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Scout II 5.9 Magnum 408 Project

2021 Arizona International Harvester Rendezvous

Lars-S

Binder Driver
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Jun 11, 2020
Messages
891
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Weather HHH and life getting in the way of practicing or welding up anything.. All coming week will be likewise..
I tried to watch/rewatch every TIG technique video I could find now that I have used mine a little... I found some contradicting or negating themselves or others BUT I think I found the essential basics along with a few ways to learn now to get to decent welds.. I need to grab a few things at Tractor Supply and try my logic/plan out but. if nothing else will learn from 'the trying' ... OK melting .. so signing off.
 

Lars-S

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Good news and bad news.. the car restoration neighbor across and down from us isn't coming north again this year.. That makes 3 in a row.. Not surprisingly he will be cleaning out his cars, engines, small trucks etc from the property and the building he would work on them in.. Couple vettes, mustang2, ford pickups, motorcyle etc.. Will miss him and the Mrs. nice couple

Good news is the diesel truck mechanic restoration neighbor that did a bunch of welding for me is going to be renting the building and property to use as his shop.. Already said I am welcome to work on the Scout in it..

Also good news the heat wave should break/end tonight... yea yea ..
 

Lars-S

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Messages
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Hope everyone had a safe and enjoyable holiday weekend if you're in the US.. Was a 4 day work weekend for us but we did have sales and the weather held so all in all a nice one.. I only managed to be able to spend a little time working on the TIG for beginners stuff. I hope to be able to give it a try again tomorrow with the "Simpleton Basics & Settings" guide along with the method I am going to use for TIG..

A for instance '' the distance for the arc - tip to metal contact" is always the same (1/8") regardless of size of thickness of materials being welded or you are welding with (electrodes).. So being able to hold that distance is a major gotcha in getting good welds/beads.. [that absolute statement is like all other absolutes aka more of a 90/10 or 80/20 or once every 37 times rule :O) ]. A PS so one doesn't even need an arch or running machine to start gaining the muscle memory to practice keeping the tip the right distance away.
 
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Lars-S

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hope it goes well for you!
Thanks! I think my gizmo will help alot towards getting good and consistent welds.. Its about 85% done. With the cheat sheet I may actually cut weeks off of training/practice..

A PS edit later in the day .. my prototype is done but going to let the crazy clue / epoxy / rtv I used set over night. Yes I used all 3 of those in my construction.
First test using/welding with it tomorrow.

Next Day Edit; oh well my clever easy to use or not use was a bust .. waiting for a semi permanent but still removable option for proto-gizmo .. hopefully will be ready to practice welding with it later today.
 
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Arkansas Dave

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Location
Pottsville, AR
Sounds like your getting it all set up, I been continuing to practice with my mig/flux welder something odd was about two weeks ago I welded several hours one day and
ever since I have lost feeling in my right thumb it has started to come back slowly but it took about 10 days before I could feel anything but pins and needles in it. I think I was
gripping it to hard and cut off the blood flow. I guess I was holding on for dear life! LOL
 

Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
Messages
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Well I definitely need more practice yet BUT I am very happy with the TIG process now ... light at the end of the tunnel and its not a 200 amp arc
Following are 3 sets of photos .. front side and back side .. One of the problems with TIG is it needs ultra clean surfaces or contaimination from back comes through to front (unlike MIG)

OK so first try with new setup ... I was running a little too hot (current) but what I didn't realize was the back still had paint and undercoating(tar) on it.
I never got around to grinding that side clean ... duh dumb dum forgets:

Train101-1-front.jpeg
Train101-1-back.jpeg



Those beads aren't very smooth but I was running too hot and couldn't get the travel speed correct but I was amazed how it welded through the junk.. Yes no filler rods yet.. this is just melting base metal.

OK so next set of two is with lower settings and an almost clean area. Well at least no tar undercoating on the backside.. These beads are all about 1/8 to 1/16 wide.

Train101-2-front.jpeg
Train101-2-back.jpeg



And last not least another front and back set.. This time I had it cranked down to almost thickness of metal ie had it at 55 amps and metal is .047-.051 ish
Also for this set both sides of metal were clean.. These beads are about a 1/16 in width..

Train101-3-front.jpeg
Train101-3-back.jpeg


Not using the pulse settings for any of this which gives it a mili second to cool allowing a nicer bead.. Also the pulsing helps to get movement correct.. That said if you have a smart phone just download a metronome app and set it up to give you the timing .. heat dab heat dab heat dab but that's to come.

The first welds were at about 72 amp way too high, second were in 60 range, and the last were low 50's.

I am very happy as with the new set up I was able to easily see the puddle forming and didn't ruin the tip of a couple of tungstens .. I was able to get the heat band down to a very narrow region as well..

All this due to two major changes.. I added 'training wheels' to my torch.. yep you read that correctly.. The hardest thing is keeping it the right distance and not bobbing and weaving while welding.. the training wheels were great for preventing that..

The second is that buried in all the video's is that the 'stick out' for the tip is equal to (or slightly less or more) than width(size) of the cup on the end of the torch.. So if one uses, as I did in these, a #8 then the width is 1/2" and the stick out from the end of it can be a 1/2". .. wow does that make it easy to see and use the torch.. Well at least for me it did.. I have all this and more in the cheat sheet I've been working on..
 

Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
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Here are some welds using the Pulse feature.. it took me a few to get it working as I misunderstood how the upper and lower amps worked.. Once I got that concept correct I was able to start stacking the beads.. Still need practice and more work on dialing in the settings but I am happy with these .. and yes still not using filler rod yet... enough to get right before add another element to the mix.

Train101-Pulse-1.jpeg
Train101-Pulse-2.jpeg



The above welds are all about 1/8" wide and barely above the surface of the parent metal as in I can feel them but we're talking .00#
I was moving by the pulse occurrence but the amount I move is what I still need to practice.. When the machine is dialed in one needs to be moving at a rate of 1/8" per second.. That was one of the hardest things to find in the videos.. I was able to get to that number by combining info from several.. My pulses are currently slightly faster than per second. I'll try and get the settings dialed in so the amps and pulse occurring every second gives correct weld penetration. With that then I can just practice trying to move at about an 1/8" every pulse.. Was supposed to be raining this morning but is sunny so will do some stuff outside and get back to welding school (LOL) around noon..

Next Day Edit ... rather than add another post:
Did about 50 practice welds today and things are OK but not good enough yet to work on parts for Scout.. I fabricated a version 2 of my TIG torch training wheels.. I realized I had not gotten the angles correct so tried to fix with version 2.. Also with Pulse the amps need to be higher and the movement rate changes a little since its going hot/cold/hot/cold/hot/cold every second. There is one guy who is so good at it he can weld large 16ga flat tables with zero warpage except a hint at the initial tacks he uses to hold sheets in place WOW .. ah me I can WARP a sheet as well or better than I could with MIG lol lol
 
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Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
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This photo is brought to you by a STEEL-IT cult worshipper LOL
Ok so I was sold on this after I saw how it held up to TIG welding and heat zone.
I have been monitoring pieces I've covered with it to see if rust has popped out which to date it hasn't
Today I worked on getting the 90 degree angles correct on the 14 ga sheet metal I had bent from a flat piece I cut out of the old gas tank.
This stuff is amazing.. I hammered and hammered on it with a steel sledge hammer. The piece I was hammering was sandwiched against the steel frame of a military trailer. I wasn't just hitting flat to flat. I hit the bend with it away from metal to get it to open up.. I also hit part of it to slam it back to 90.. As you can see from the photos .. the STEEL-IT coating wasn't phased a bit by at least 5 solid minutes of hammering.

Steel-It-Bashed.jpg
 

Jeff W

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Nov 7, 2019
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This photo is brought to you by a STEEL-IT cult worshipper LOL
Ok so I was sold on this after I saw how it held up to TIG welding and heat zone.
I have been monitoring pieces I've covered with it to see if rust has popped out which to date it hasn't
Today I worked on getting the 90 degree angles correct on the 14 ga sheet metal I had bent from a flat piece I cut out of the old gas tank.
This stuff is amazing.. I hammered and hammered on it with a steel sledge hammer. The piece I was hammering was sandwiched against the steel frame of a military trailer. I wasn't just hitting flat to flat. I hit the bend with it away from metal to get it to open up.. I also hit part of it to slam it back to 90.. As you can see from the photos .. the STEEL-IT coating wasn't phased a bit by at least 5 solid minutes of hammering.

View attachment 210855
Impressive!...I've been thinking about what to paint my quarter panel insides before I spot weld them on. Honestly, I haven't been really impressed with POR15, and Rustbullet creates a hard shell but bubbled up easily with paint/rust removing pad on the opposite side of the metal. I like the looks of it post weld/beating. Maybe I'll give it a go
 

Lars-S

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I will be seam welding this piece inside another. I also will be seam welding two large panels 18 ga to 14 ga. All have been sprayed with this. Will post pics and observations after I do.
 

Jeff W

Farmall Cub
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Nov 7, 2019
Messages
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kinda wish I saw this before I put my rockers together...ordered some for the inner rear quarters. Did you find it cheaper than this?

 

Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
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I saw that and another that showed using and welding with it .. sorry thought I had posted video link as to why I got and tried it to begin with .. A PS in the one video he tried both the spray and saving money on buying the quart cans.. the spray lays down nice and flat the can even with a smooth roller never does.. It coats no see in one layer.. guess its the stainless in it that keeps it from laying down when brushed or rolled.. I got bought two for the free shipping .. Its expensive no doubt due to the stainless in it .. everyone else wanted 28+.. Yea it seems perfect for inside rockers and such.. I think though that its not meant to be a topcoat so if an exposed area then put something over it.. They do make an epoxy version of it (even more expensive) that is a top coat but believe its not OK to weld to. The can you can weld right onto it with MIG .. I did with TIG but needed to scratch it to get an arc going.. I think though for strength of TIG welds it is better to clean the immediate area of everything to shiny metal (especially if structural) so I will grind back a 1/16 or 1/8" and weld then top coat it.
 

Lars-S

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Well I think your money isn't wasted.. I spot welded a 1/2" long piece of cad coated steel to a piece of the 14ga coated with Steel-It (SI).. In this case I didn't scrap or grind away any of the SI since the cad piece allowed an arc to fire.. Did a couple of tacks at 70 amps.. Here are the results.. for side I was welding on and the backside of the same area..

Tack-Steel-It-1.jpeg
Tack-Steel-It-2.jpeg
Tack-Steel-It-3.jpeg



I was wearing my respirator. I actually wear it all the time now as it isn't uncomfortable and just fits under my helmet. The weld isn't perfect but I am happy for what it is there for.. Once bolt is throught it won't be going anywhere. Also cad coated to coated steel in a rounded upright isn't an easy weld .

PS I didn't use any fill rod just simple fusion tacks to secure it in its location.
 
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Lars-S

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OK I luv this TIG welder .. for what it does and was less than $240 what's not to luv..
Here are my 14 ga seam welds.. I still don't have the technique yet for stopping and then starting a weld at the same spot but couple of these fusion runs are ..
no grinder needed here.. IMO lol lol

Tig101-Seam-Welds-1.jpg


Late Wed edit .. I then started welding this to the rest of the upright for the radiator/hood main front support.. I had some gap and it was a butt weld so I started using filler rod. I found for me if I use way smaller filler rod it works better but of course requires faster feeding of it.. Like with the seam welds though trying to restart is still not the best..
 
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Lars-S

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Just finished grinding (need real close fit for the TIG) the edges ot the sheet metal plates going on the front radiator uprights. It's still ultra hot and humid so take a break and then WELD them up ..least that's the plan.. Once they are in place I can work on the rear portion of the inner fenderss (the part that goes over the tires). Tomorrow is work again so I really would like to get this done today.. Unfortunately also have to mow so late this afternoon is shot. Had trouble with mower yesterday but hopefully will be OK today.. I shut it down to check oil ..can't afford to have the engine seize on it.
 

Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
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Here's some photos of front inners we are rebuilding. One side we just are redoing the bottom sheet metal with heavy 14 ga. The other side we cut off the bottom as it was too badly rusted, bent up a new channel with inner body support channel, and then welded that on to the original piece. In addition to seam welding the inner section we did a spot weld on both sides.. Third is a photo of the 14ga plate we made to redo it.. The rear inner fender pieces then get welded onto these new heavy front pieces.

Front Inner Left?
Front-Inner-Left-1.jpeg



And here is the piece we replaced on the bottom of the other side.. Its fusion TIG welded .. it still needs a small patch in front ..

Front-Inner-Right-1.jpeg


And here is the 14ga piece that goes on this side the inner fender then welds to.

Front-Inner-Right-2.jpeg
 

Lars-S

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Jun 11, 2020
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OK one done around the bottom outside.. ran out of gas so ended a little early for today.. This panel is normally spot weld on.. I seam welded the entire outside edge (good practice area). At times it went perfect, even using filler rod, and at times well a little ugly but definitely solid.. I'm OK with it it..

Front-Panel-1.jpeg
Front-Panel-2.jpeg
 
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