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MiniBuild 18 ~ Putting Scout II axles on an 800

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Damian Grihalva

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Personally, I would use an adjustable proportioning valve. Eric can hook you up on those. We carry TSM kits, and they sell p-valves. Give Eric a call, he's pretty good at getting things shipped quick.

I will also say that with the Vette MC's lately haven't been doing the trick, or should I say that I haven't been able to get a good one ~ even buying them 'new'. So recently I've started using standard Scout II MCs

Either way, with rear discs you should use an adjustable p-valve so you can dial in your rear brake bias.
 

scout2000

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Personally, I would use an adjustable proportioning valve. Eric can hook you up on those. We carry TSM kits, and they sell p-valves. Give Eric a call, he's pretty good at getting things shipped quick.

I will also say that with the Vette MC's lately haven't been doing the trick, or should I say that I haven't been able to get a good one ~ even buying them 'new'. So recently I've started using standard Scout II MCs

Either way, with rear discs you should use an adjustable p-valve so you can dial in your rear brake bias.

Hello Damian,

Thank you for your post.

On my 800, I am using (both front and back) the Stainless Steel Brake's 4 wheel disc brake kit. I recently visited with SSB, and they indicated that the parts that they had used to build their kit (rotors, calipers, etc) were from the SVO Mustangs.

I am far from being any type of a brake expert, and I didn't know what issues, if any, might come into play as I had identical brake components both front and rear, in regards to the proportioning valve.

I will touch base with Eric next week.
 

Damian Grihalva

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So, if your brakes are all the same size (disk and calipers) and you hit the brakes hard, your rear brakes will lock up first. The thing to remember is that the front brakes are responsible for most of the braking ~ they have most of the weight as well. And if you don't put a p-valve in there, or you use the wrong one, when those rear brakes lock, you can really put yourself in some hairy situations..

The adjustable p-valve allows you to adjust the rear brakes 'power' down till the front brakes lock-up first.

When you install the p-valve, you want to install it inline with the rear brakes. You can put it along the frame, or in the engine compartment (near or on the firewall). Do not put one on the front brakes ~ you want those to have full 'power'. The adjuster actually limits the amount of pressure, so when installed on the rear, you can 'dial down' the pressure till you get the bias you like.
 

scout2000

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Thanks again for the reply and the tech info Damian.

I have sent Eric an email for the adjustable proportioning valve, and will follow up with him next week.
 

eric.kcmo

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Is there any way to recover the photos for the first series of posts? It looks like they got moved when the D and C website was updated....
 

Damian Grihalva

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my understanding is that the website will be moved back to the first server when they're done tweeking it. At that time, the pictures will return.

But I'll send an email to Eric about it. The webguy could fix this in like 2 minutes if he bothered.
 

Oil Scout

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Images are not working. suggestions?

A stock Scout 800.
mb18_1.jpg


Although they are a nice looking ~ definately original design with uncommonly good off-road performance, there are several reasons to put Scout II axles on a Scout 80/800. Here are a few:
1) They turn sharper ~ making it easier to turn around without backing up
2) They are wider ~ this makes them more sturdy when lifted, as well as allow bigger tires without excessive rubbing on the frame/springs (which is common on early model scouts)
3) Better Brakes ~ Swapping old small drum brakes with more powerful disc/drums give MUCH better braking performance. They also don't pull to one side when in quick/emergency braking. They also don't fade after long hills or water crossings
4) Ease in turning ~ Some will say that, after the conversion, steering feels like power-steering. Even though its not, in comparison to the stock high-friction hard-to-turn manners, the open-knuckle design is MUCH easier to turn. Expecially in parking lots or at low speeds.
5) Parts availability. Scout II Dana 44s have Ford brakes, and standard gears/lockers/bearings. Not just cheaper to buid, but maintain.


Thats why you should consider the swap. Here's a quick 'HOW'.

Early Scout frames are wider than Scout IIs. Therefore you must move BOTH front and rear perches. This requires welding. The rear is easy. Strip the axle's stock perches then put it on the springs with new perches between it and the springs. I normally LOOSELY put the u-bolts in place as well.
mb18_2.jpg

Then, using a measureing tape, center the axle on the springs. LIGHTLY tighten the u-bolts to keep the axle centered. Then use your jack to possition the pinion angle (which whould point up at the same angle the t-case yoke points down).

The front axle is also fairly easy but much more involved. First you have to make the new U-bolts fit. To do this, simply grind a path so that they will fit securely around the housing.
mb18_3.jpg


Test fit the U-bolts.
mb18_4.jpg

mb18_5.jpg


Then measure the old perches distance from each other (center of hole to center of hole) and determine how wide you much place the new perches on the Scout II axles. I find its about 1" ~ but double check your measurements.
mb18_7.jpg


Instead of recreating the perche with weld or what-have-you, I simply take a small perch (Warior Industries 175) and cut off one leg. I then place it on the housing to match the amount it needs to be wider than the Scout II perch. Then I tack-weld it on.
mb18_6.jpg

Please note. Its easiest to use the stock perch to set the angle. This will give your front axle the stock amount of caster that is built into the Scout II front end from the factory. You can ADD caster with a pair of shims if you'd like more.

Put the other perch on, but you shouldn't have to weld it at this point.
mb18_8.jpg


Re-install the front axle. The springs center pin will/should fit into the passenger-side perch you've already put on. This will position the axle on the springs. You may want to put the U-bolts on to keep the pinion angle right.
mb18_9.jpg


With the shackles tight, you should be able to position the driver-side perch between the axle and spring. This should be the final placement of that perch ~ HOWEVER, make sure by taking several measurements to confirm the axle is centered under the scout. YOu can do this by measuring between BOTH perches and the outer parts of the axle. Standing back and looking can also be an easy way to see if something is immediately wrong.

Once you are SURE that the axle is centered, tack weld the driver-side perch, remove the axle for final welding, clean and paint it, and re-install.
mb18_10.jpg
 

61BOUND

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D & C is here in Colorado Springs, so I can call over there and ask them.
 

61BOUND

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I emailed D & C, and Matt said that he is going to see what he can do to restore the images. He was not sure about timing, so we just need to be patient.
 

KenoV

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Anyone else sill hoping that these photos get restored? I've been scowering the net for a good walkthrough of a D44 axle swap, but not a large amount of details out there.
 

BigRigg

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Anyone else sill hoping that these photos get restored? I've been scowering the net for a good walkthrough of a D44 axle swap, but not a large amount of details out there.
Check out project Esther in the build forum. I just posted pictures of this swap, and I followed the same method that Damian used in this build.
 

Shannon

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Over the last few months I've built several SUA (Spring UNDER axle, aka. Stock orientation) Scout 800s with Scout II axles. I'd like to share some of the ways I do that by taking pictures from all these milder builds and putting them in one place for your viewing pleasure.
Damien, The pictures are not showing up on this thread anymore - at least for me. Do you still have them. Starting my 67 Scout 800 build and this information is very helpful. Thanks!
 

walkersscout

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He hasn't been on the board for 4 years. Just start a new thread in the builds section, show some pics of what you have, start asking your questions. I just finished doing an SUA swap in my 800. It is on my my "Tip" scout build page.
 

67NCScout

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Damien, The pictures are not showing up on this thread anymore - at least for me. Do you still have them. Starting my 67 Scout 800 build and this information is very helpful. Thanks!

Shannon,
Check out this build by IHPA.
http://forums.ihpartsamerica.com/showthread.php?t=9191

I got a lot of good information from it when I did my build. As walkersscout said start start a build thread with pictures and ask questions. There is a wealth of info and knowledge here on BinderPlanet.
 
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