Spring swap questions

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by 2nd Scout, Nov 8, 2017.


  1. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    Greetings fellow binder enthusiasts.

    I’m in the process of swapping out my stock springs with some 2.5” RC springs and I have run into a snag or two. I’m hoping for some help. I have a 1980 Scout II diesel.

    1. When removing the spring bolt from the front left spring, it won’t come out. The nut came off fine but the bolt just spins. A 2 lb sledge would not budge it. I’m guessing it is severely fused to the sleeve. I hosed it down with PB blaster and left it sitting. Any thoughts on how I might get that bolt out? The bolt on the rear of the spring came right out.

    2. Anyone know what size all of the spring bolts are so I can order new ones? The kit only came with U bolts.

    3. Do I need to replace the little spacer on the passenger front spring when going back with 2.5” RC lift springs? This is the one that drops the passenger side about 1/4”.

    Thanks in advance for any help.






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  2. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    Saws-All. (Or hacksaw if you have more time than money.) Sometimes the bolts can gall/rust and fuse with the sleeve. All you can do it cut through the old bushing end and hack off the ends of the bolt.

    For the bolts themselves, they are just 7/16" Grade 8. I forget the exact length of the factory bolts, but you measure that yourself. And there's probably about 1/2" of leeway on the length. If you have a decent hardware store in your area you should have no trouble finding them. For the nuts, use the "prevailing torque" acorn style.
     
  3. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    And you probably want to use that spacer under the axle with your new springs.

    I should ask, are you planning to reuse your stock shackles or use new ones? I ask because, A) if you are reusing them, take care with your saw not to rip up the shackles, and B) if you're using new shackles and they are thicker than the factory ones, you need to acct for when buying the bolts. (Might need to go 1/4 to 1/2" longer.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2017
  4. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    Thanks Patrick.

    That’s a good idea. It’s a bit tight between the spring and shackle though. Hope I can get a sawsall blade in there. Maybe I’ll drive a wedge in there to open it up some.

    Yes, I’m reusing the old shackles. I’ll be careful.






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  5. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    That's also a good idea, shoving the spring over and away from the shackle if you can. And if you do gouge it a little, it's easily cleaned up with a flapper wheel. And reproduction stock shackles are plentiful and not expensive, if you do happen to really mess one up.

    And when you put it all together again, slather the bolts and sleeve insides with at little anti-seize.
     
  6. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    For posterity, I measured and the bolts are 4” long.


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  7. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    After spraying with PB blaster and letting it sit a few days, the sledge hammer approach finally knocked the bolt free, so I didn’t have to cut anything.

    When I dropped the springs, I found that someone added caster shims, but I think they were in backwards. The high side was to the rear, which would reduce caster, right? I am not going to use them with the new springs. It has always handled fine, but might be better with a bit more caster.


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  8. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    Hmm. Yeah, that is weird. Do you know what angle they are? And the material they are made of? If they are aluminum, zinc, or other soft metal, I would not bother re-using them even if you decided to install them in the normal way.

    The only reason I can think of to tilt the axle assy forward would be to "fix" the pinion angle. But that's completely unnecessary with the stock suspension.

    How much fourwheeling are you planning on doing? I ask because if you do decide to improve the caster with shims (even a mild lift can reduce caster slightly), it will increase your pinion-to-TC angles. However, I actually fourwheeled for years with a pinion angle "screwed up" in this way. It never hurt anything I'm aware of.

    Can you post a pic or two of the shims?
     
  9. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    The shims look like aluminum, but definitely soft metal. The driveshaft angle was not an issue. No idea why they were in there. The angle of the front drive shaft with the new springs is a little steep at full droop, but it is not going to bind. Mine is mostly a pavement pounder anyway, so I am not concerned about it. I guess I will drive it around a while and see if it acts like it needs more caster. If it does, I'll install some new shims. Thanks for the feedback.
     
  10. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    Well, if it was driving fine in your opinion before with those problematical shims, I doubt you will have any complaints with the new setup. Have fun with it!
     
  11. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    Just to wrap things up, thought I would post some before/after pics.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]





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    Darrel and 'Mater like this.
  12. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    Very sharp looking. How does it ride and handle now? Okay so far?
     
  13. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    Thanks! It rides surprisingly well, actually. I need to drive it a bit more before I can be sure about the steering geometry.


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  14. RinTX

    RinTX Binder Driver

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    Your Scout looks awesome!
     
  15. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    Thank you


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  16. INT77345

    INT77345 Farmall Cub

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    you have a great looking scout !

    the lift gives it a good stance !
     
  17. 2nd Scout

    2nd Scout Farmall Cub

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    One more question for you guys. The Scout leans a bit to the driver side now. I know this is not uncommon, but wondered what I can do about it. Yes, I reused the drop spacer on the passenger side spring. Thanks.


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  18. Darrel

    Darrel High Wheeler

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    How much lean? The best place to measure is from the bumpstop bracket to the axle.
    Spacers front and rear? Body bushings in good shape? Shocks?
    There's only so much you can do.
    Loosen all 8 shackle bolts and bounce the suspension.
    Swap springs side to side.
    Pull the springs and measure the free arch.
    Have the springs re-arched.
    Have custom spring spacers made.
    Return the springs.
     
  19. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Y-Block King

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    This is what i would do first, assuming the lean doesn't "settle out" by itself somehow. And measuring the free arch is a good idea while you're doing the swap, just to check that one obvious thing. Once the springs are off (we'll assume the front for now) flip them upside down and stand them side by side to see if one's higher than the other. Hopefully one will be and that the low one was on the driver-side. Doesn't need to be by much. Even 1/8" of height difference can make a difference.

    And the body-frame being a rigid thing, might not even be the front springs causing the lean. Might have to try this with the back as well because it could be an overly strong rear passenger-side spring causing the lean.

    The custom-shim idea would probably work well to even it out too, but since the passenger side is already higher, all you could do is go with a thicker shim to lower the passenger side a little. And nobody wants to lower their lift. LOL Bummer that it's always the driver-side that is lower in these situations, because raising the passenger side is so straightforward---just use a thinner/no shim on the PS.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  20. fdydguy

    fdydguy Farmall Cub

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    Check your spring bushings. I put a new set of springs under one of mine and it had a little lean. I put new shocks on and it still did but less. New poly bushings all around and fresh shackles fixed it


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