Spark plugs

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by RinTX, Aug 18, 2019.


  1. RinTX

    RinTX High Wheeler

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    I know this has been covered. If the search function were not so difficult I may have answered my own question. If my memory weren’t so terrible - I wouldn’t have to ask.

    73 1010 Travelall with a 304. Are the correct NGK plugs 3332?

    I also see a 7355 Iridium plug. Any opinions- are they worth the extra money?
     
  2. jeff campbell

    jeff campbell Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Myself would stick with original/basic plugs. Champs or 85s
     
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  3. scout2000

    scout2000 Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    Jeff,

    That has been my experience also. Regardless of spark plug sponsors claims on past issues of Spike TV, rarely have I seen any benefit to fancy spark plugs in older engines. And, WFIW, those benefits weren't improved power or fuel economy.

    Completely off topic here, but I would be interested if different spark plugs did anything for more modern engines.
     
  4. tahoedonner

    tahoedonner Binder Driver

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    NGK 3332 is the correct NGK plug. I like them quite a bit. Others like other plugs.
     
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  5. Greg R

    Greg R Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    As far as I can tell, the NGK and Autolite spark plugs are both good quality and the NGK 3332 and Autolite 85 are virtually identical in heat range and materials. I would use either and price wise they are also about the same. Iridium? Yes it is a more durable plug, longer service life providing the engine is in good shape, no oil consumption to any great degree, or fuel problems. Keeping CO in about the 2.8 to 3% range they could easily go 60K miles. Spark plug based performance is only small numbers provided everything else upstream, i.e. ignition, compression, fuel trim is also in specification and that the plugs fit the APPLICATION i.e. street or strip, boost or natural.

    In modern engines with today's ECMs the ECMs also can look at spark voltage and spark duration. In effect the ECM (Engine Control Module) has many more inputs available, especially with Coil On Plug or COP distributorless ignition. These inputs all play into the ECM's control of fuel trim, timing, to affect power and maintain the voltage they like to see at the O2 sensor. Factory plugs or factory specified plugs are the way to go as running with plugs that can give different spark duration or spark voltages other than what the vehicle's ECM is looking for may be a step backward performance wise.
     
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  6. scoutboy74

    scoutboy74 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    I'm a fan of the NGK 3332 as well. Autolites used to be made in the USA. Then they went to Mexico. Later, they went to Jynuh. NGK have always been made in Japan. If the Autolites were still being made here, I probably never would have switched to the NGKs. But I did switch, and they've been good to me.
     
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  7. tahoedonner

    tahoedonner Binder Driver

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    Just for conversation sake. I use iridium plugs in my Nissan Altima Hybrid because they’re supposed to withstand repeated starts IE (longevity) better than a conventional plug. If that’s the case I see no reason for iridium plugs in a Scout
     
  8. David Banner

    David Banner High Wheeler

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    Absolutely -- my DD Saab 9000 w/trionic eng management -- the NGK plug was selected and the required resistance, anti-knock sensing, etc is all through the spark plug. Different brand plugs with different resistance wreak havoc on the ignition coil pack -- mis-fires and ultimately failure...
     
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  9. scout2000

    scout2000 Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    Wow !

    I made assumptions that specific plugs would be more important in newer vehicles, but I had no idea the impact could be that extensive.
     
  10. mallen

    mallen High Wheeler

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    I allways use ngk. Had issues with others. Don't bother with the Platinum or iridium plogs on vehicles that don't come from the factory with them. Some vehicles don't run well with them. Considering how simplistic the ignition is in the IH, it's probably ok, but I'd rather not take the effort to experiment to see which vehicles can and cant use them.It has been my experience that the number one cause of problems with older vehicles is to many "improvements". Every single one has a laundry list of pros and cons. But the pro list of original is short and sweet, when it rolled off the , it worked like that,pretty close to perfectly. That is why I prefer to keep things like they were from the factory, unless I have some specific compelling reason the change it. I don't consider longer maintenance intervals to be particularly compelling. Just pull em,check em, regap em and reinstall em. When they wear out replace em, they are cheap. (Don't get me wrong, there are some changes that make sense. For example, electronic ignition. Points sucked,always did, and as soon as something better came along, it totally replaced them, for good reason,and the upgrade is super simple and works flawlessly)
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
  11. stroker3

    stroker3 Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    That has me thinking about the Dodge. Mines 'newer' but not that new and if it was easy I'd just look but I'm pretty sure they'd be mopar. I have been wondering who made plugs for chrysler back in 2000. In my old age I've become more and more of a 'if it ain't broke' guy and owniing the durango since 01' I'm 100% positive the plugs havn't been changed. Nearing 200k and it's still starts right up quickly and runs very smooth. I'm sure that'll change at some point so I'm kinda wondering if anyone would know.
     
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  12. David Banner

    David Banner High Wheeler

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    In the case of the 9000 T-5 trionic -- it's the first ECU (appeared in 1992...) to integrate/control fuel, turbo boost pressure, and distributorless ign all in one -- the ign coil pack bolts directly to the head -- there are no sparkplug wires -- there is no independent knock sensor -- the sparkplug becomes an integrated piece of the circuit just like using the right diode or resistor...

    Sometimes I think it's stupidly over-engineered but most times I marvel at the synchronicity...
    Mines about to hit 281,000 miles -- the only engine work it's needed is annual oil changes and I replace a leaking oil pump seal 100k ago or so...
     
  13. David Banner

    David Banner High Wheeler

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    I don't but will anecdotally add when I changed plugs on a friends Saturn I discovered the GM dealership had the best price for the uncommon size plug it took. Worth a phone call and you'll know it's the right spec plug, not just the right size and heat range plug...
     
  14. scout2000

    scout2000 Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    I had to go look that up, as I had no idea what a 9000 T-5 trionic is/was.

    So is this technology unique to Saab? Wondering if other vendors have similar or competing technologies? I have to admit, aside from reading all the new/crazy things going on with the 2020 Corvette, I've done a poor job on staying up with current automotive technologies.
     
  15. David Banner

    David Banner High Wheeler

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    Can't be -- GM was a 20% owner of SAAB in the 1980's. GM took full ownership in 1998 all the way to bankruptcy :censored: --
    The Saab name is now owned by NEV, a chinese company... :drown:

    GM would then own/further develop the T-5 & T-7 technology as they saw useful...

    Getting harder and harder to find oem quality repair parts -- sound familiar?
     
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  16. scout2000

    scout2000 Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    OMG . . . . . you don't know the half of it. :(
     
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  17. mallen

    mallen High Wheeler

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    Theres a whole bunch of current research in the literature on using spark plugs as an ion sensor to monitor the combustion process. Its done to some extent on many modern vehicles, but that just the tip of the ice berg so to speak. It looks like it may be possible to eliminate pretty much all of the sensors on an engine. The signal from a spark plug can determine knock, optimal timing, and fuel air mixture. Once they figure it all out and get the hiccups ironed out, it will likely result in better power,fuel economy and emissions with a significant reduction in cost. Virtually no down side.
     
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  18. jordandoc

    jordandoc Binder Driver

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    Back to the basics (what to use for IH)...I run Crane capacitor discharge ignitions on all my IH's triggered by either Pertronix or OEM electronic distributors. Because of the high voltage, it is recommended NOT to use resistor plugs or resistor wires. I called NGK and asked them what to use. The tech said 2298's. I gap them at .045 (have gapped Champions to .060 although there is no added benefit according to research) and never had a problem. You can only use this gap with capacitor discharge ignitions as stock voltage ignitions may not have enough "juice" to fire them reliably. These are NON-resistor but I don't care about the stereo radio...where I live there's no reception anyway and I have no desire to drive a vehicle resembling a speaker-on-wheels. If you're using a stock ignition, there is no need for a fancy plug. If you want a not-so-costly upgrade, go to Capacitor discharge. When you pull a coil wire on a running IH with stock ignition, you'll see a small orange spark...with CD ignition it's a blue flame with a loud "cracking" noise. Use rubber handled pliers and don't lean against the body if you try this...you won't need Viagra if you do!
    Dan
     
  19. mallen

    mallen High Wheeler

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    I was told by MSD to use the standard resistor plugs and magnetic suppression wires with the 6A
     
  20. RinTX

    RinTX High Wheeler

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    I bought the NGK 3332s. I haven’t installed yet because I’m finishing up a carb rebuild. Don’t want to change anything until after the carb is back on and it’s running again.
    I’m not sure what the capacitor discharge ignition is exactly. I’ve used Bill Hamilton’s info to convert the Holley points distributor to reluctor wheel and magnetic pickup coupled with the GM HEI module.
     

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