SOLVED- Ignition issues! was: 1967 S800 4cylinder not running right- ideas?

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by Scoutcamper, Jul 28, 2019.


  1. scoutboy74

    scoutboy74 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Not the coil wire. Seems like that would be due to its present and incorrect association with the other wires. The oil, temp and fuel gauges function via variable resistance feedback from their respective senders.
     
  2. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    Woot! Got it up and running again today! I ordered the UC15 T on Amazon, it was supposed to be here Friday but they were back ordered. After some trial and error found a coil at O'reilly that seemed to match Scoutboy74's resistance numbers pretty well, I believe it was listed for a '67 VW Bug. Right around 2.0 Ohm primary resistance.

    Plugged in the new coil, new condenser, and threw a spare set of new points on there for good measure.

    It started right up and idles like a champ.

    Driveability is not so great, I suspect I've got some dialing in to do on the rebuilt carb.

    It started out with a bad bog and stumble at tip-in, and seemed really boggy overall. I leaned out the idle mixture and now it is almost driveable, with just a little hesitation and the occasional backfire if I give it too much throttle.

    I should have a chance to get out there in the morning with a vac gauge and dwell / tach to set it up better.

    I'll start a new carb tuning thread if I do.

    -Josh
     
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  3. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    Incidentally, this is with no changes to the existing wiring hookups. Still running the signal to the fuel pump relay from the connector feeding the coil positive.

    I'm definitely planning a full re-wire at this point. Just need to buy a kit and find a weekend to install it.

    -Josh
     
  4. Don B

    Don B Binder Driver

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    Glad this was sorted out. For spark I always assume coil, condenser, plugs first.
     
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  5. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    Yup. That's the frustrating thing. I did that, but bad part(s) from the get-go had me chasing my tail.

    -Josh
     
  6. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    Here is the coil that I ended up using. Master Pro 2-5195 from O'reilly, cost about $23.

    -Josh

    20190825_082433.jpg
     
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  7. Don B

    Don B Binder Driver

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    A lot of the standard old school ignition parts are pretty much crap right out of the box these days. Coils and plugs being the ones with early failure rate in my experience.
    Best to keep some spares handy!
     
  8. scoutboy74

    scoutboy74 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    I hate to rain on your parade, but from my checking, the specs on that coil say 1.5 ohm primary resistance just like you had before. It may get you by for awhile, but I'm betting you will eventually begin to notice performance issues again as the coil goes through several overheat cycles and fails in the same manner as before. Once again, it's a good coil for a V8 engine, but not for 4 and 6 cylinders. You really need to get one with 3 ohms primary resistance. Going so far as to measure it in the store before you walk out with it isn't a bad idea. There's no short cuts on this one. You need the right part.
     
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  9. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    The UC15 T finally came in from Amazon this evening, so I'll throw that and a new condenser in the glove box and see how long this one lasts. Also going to check the primary resistance on the UC15 T and see what it measures so we have it for the record.

    I appreciate your take on it, and I'm not dismissing it, but the coil that I first removed looked to be original, was in the Scout since I bought it, and gave me at least a couple hundred miles since I owned it, but measured at 2.2 ohms across the primary. I also have done a good bit of idling while tuning, and a few test drives at this point and not found the new coil getting hot like the others did almost immediately. I'm curious to see what happens, but I'll keep the spare parts on hand.

    -Josh
     
  10. Scoutcamper

    Scoutcamper Farmall Cub

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    Follow up: Well, I owe Scoutboy74 a virtual beer, or a real one if he makes it out to Phoenix. The 2-5195 coil went out after I'm guessing about 200 miles total, same symptoms as before- motor would initially fire up, then immediately start to lose spark once it started to get warm. After several more attempts to start, no spark at all. I've also been running REALLY rich, and accidentally left the ignition on for about 1/2 hour after parking, a few drives ago. Don't know how much those things factored in.

    I threw in the UC15 T and it fired right up. For the record, the UC15 T measured 2.8 ohms across the primary before install. We'll see how long it lasts. Definitely have a full rewire in the future on this project.

    -Josh
     
  11. scoutboy74

    scoutboy74 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Phoenix, Orygun...hell, that ain't that far away...oh snap...Arid-zona. Guess I'll have to settle for the cyber-suds. Hopefully that coil will smooth things out for you. I'd be taking a good, close look at your points again after that long of a key on/engine stopped session. That's bad ju-ju for any style of ignition parts.
     
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  12. Don B

    Don B Binder Driver

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    Some of these new coils are crap! I had a flamethrower last about a month before it was shot. One thing to check is how much oil is in the coil which you can hear if you tilt it back and forth, the fuller the better! My old Healey had the coil mounted upside down and if the coil wasn’t Full of oil overheated and crapped out. Actually I’ve had more luck with used coils from the wrecker than new ones. Doesn’t seem right but there you have it. A spare with condenser is a good thing to carry with you.

    Don B
     
  13. scoutboy74

    scoutboy74 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    It's not like you can add oil to them after the fact. There's no dipstick to pull and no fill plug to remove. They have what they have in them and that's that. The name of the game has always been and will continue to be ensuring correct resistance to match the number of engine cylinders and ignition style in place, ie points versus electronic. With due dilligence done in that regard, the rest takes care of itself.
     
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  14. Blaine Man

    Blaine Man Farmall Cub

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    This has been a very interesting thread, I learned a lot about the coil requirements. I do not run my Scout on the road so after plowing a four miles of 2 track of snow it never heats up. Good news for me this weekend! Stumbled on a EBay auction and won with a brand new Weber 32/36 carburetor complete with air cleaner and a intake manifold for a Miget GT. Got it with free delivery for $74, finally work on getting rid of the piece of sxxt carburetors I have been dealing with.
     
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