Scout II accelerator pedal return

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by Tremor, Aug 29, 2020.


  1. Tremor

    Tremor Farmall Cub

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    Hey there, new here so sorry if this thread is is in the wrong spot. I looked over the forums as well as my shop manual and could not find an answer and I'm new here. In my 1978 Scout II I recently bought, the gas pedal is bungied from the pedal attached to the hardtop, after applying pressure without it the pedal barely returns. both the channel and pivot look fine. Just a little lost on what could be causing this any help is appreciated!
    Thanks,
    Sam
     
  2. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    This I gotta see. The bungie's attached to the hardtop? Or the pedal is somehow attached to the hardtop? The mind reels.

    Can you post a pic? It's easy to do if your pic is on your device. Just click the Upload a File button and the bottom and go from there.

    But in response for now, the Scout's pedal has no return spring of its own. It relies on the return springs of the carburetor and gravity to return to position when you lift your foot off the gas. For example, when my accelerator cable is disconnected from the carburetor, the pedal just kind flops back and forth pretty easily. You may as well also post a pic of your carb's left side so we can see what is going on there, return-spring wise.

    And BTW, this is the correct forum for such questions. Welcome!
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
  3. theloneduck

    theloneduck Binder Driver

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    Here are some examples of my return springs and that general area. I had to clean the linkages for it to return after a sticky pedal situation.

    Edit: my rig is a 79 scout 2, 345, 4 barrel edelbrock 1406 carb[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
  4. TravelerMan79

    TravelerMan79 Farmall Cub

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    Welcome! I too recently acquired my Scout Traveler. My accelerator return spring is pictured below, but I'm sure it is not correct as it would bend at full throttle due to interference with the carburetor throttle lever. At the time, I did look as well to see what the correct OEM configuration was, but truthfully, I saw all kinds of different setups. I just went through my manual, and this is the best I could find.

    My throttle "return" spring. 79 Traveler with 345 2 bbl and cruise.
    image.jpeg

    From the CTS-2413 Manual Vol. 2. You can see just a portion of the return spring attached to the carburetor throttle lever. As Patrick mentioned above, the gas pedal has no return spring of its own as I just removed mine.
    image.jpeg

    I'm guessing this is either stk or similar to stk. The second pic seems to resemble the spring/angle in the manual, but I'm again guessing there were probably multiple configurations depending if they were equipped with cruise and other emissions add-ones. It would be nice if some of the more knowledgable folks could chime in to clarify this.
    image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
     
  5. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    That is the factory setup, the spring coming off the tab on the intake. At least for manual-transmission Scouts. Might have been different for the automatics though, all the extra hardware you guys have on the throttle. Mounting it over onto the T-stat housing is not a bad idea at all.
     
  6. TravelerMan79

    TravelerMan79 Farmall Cub

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    You sure? Because the spring interferes with carb throttle linkage at full throttle.
     
  7. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Not on my carb(s). But as I was saying, you have a bunch of junk on your throttle that I don't have. My scout's a 4-speed. It can also depend on the kind of carb you have. Throttle arms are a little different between the factory 2300, 2210, and aftermarket 2300. Where the spring connects on the arm matters a great deal.
     
  8. BigRigg

    BigRigg Y-Block King

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    First off, welcome!
    Also, 2 things could cause this. 1. Weak return spring. You can get springs in the dorman area of your local parts house.
    2. The cable inside the jacket is damaged. Remove the cable from the carb accelerator arm. Then move the cable in and out of the jacket. Does the cable feel ok? If it's tough to move, or has a catch, then you need clean it. If that doesnt work you'll need a new cable.

    The first thing I would do is pull the spring and see if it still has snap left.
     
  9. Kurt_M

    Kurt_M Farmall Cub

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    I have a 76 Traveler with 2210 carb and no cruise control, spring is attached down to the manifold mounted bracket like Travelerman's picture. On my 77 with cruise control the bracket is there on the manifold but the spring is attached forward to avoid contacting the cruise bracket like mentioned.
     
  10. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    I already requested a pic of the carb, left side, firstly to see if it even has a spring, secondly if it's in good shape, hooked up correctly, etc. Hopefully the OP will accommodate. Good call on the cable housing's liner. Could be something gummed up in there.
     
  11. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Yep. That's the carb mine came with. 4-speed, no cruise. That position works perfectly fine with this setup. No binding/interference at all.

    Now for an aftermarket 2300 you don't want to use that 6 o'clock position and just hook the spring in the big hole, as seen in the example below. I'll catch on the throttle cable end at WOT. And hooking that far aft on the lever may make the spring go "over center" at WOT as well. Not good. It's best to drill a little hole in that tab farther forward. You could then move the spring one bolt forward, but it really isn't necessary.

    RANDOM Image I found:
    [​IMG]

    HERE'S my engine with a 7448 (2300) carb. I drilled a hole in that position. Factory mounting for the spring works perfectly fine; no interference or over-centering at WOT.
    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Tremor

    Tremor Farmall Cub

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    [​IMG]
    Here's a link to the photo that was requested- https://ibb.co/fSZvx71. forgot to take one of the actual pedal and linkage but I will be sure to do so later. Upon closer inspection today spring looks too pretty worn, but it also definitely could be loose or gunked up throttle cable. at petal contact it looks like there's a small amount of slack, don't know if this could be caused by it being gunked up if its stretched out and needs to be tightened or adjusted or just needs replacing.
    Thanks again everyone
     
  13. WAR WAGON

    WAR WAGON Farmall Cub

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    I am not sure if this applies to your situation but my experience with a SII accelerator pedal cable was so unusual and so vexing that I need to bring it up. The cable makes a bend as it approaches the firewall. I did not know it, but the cable started sawing through the cable housing, creating a shorter path. I readjusted the linkage. Drive it a bit. Soon the engine would be overrevving the throttle again (stuck throttle). Readjusted it, it would then saw through some more cable housing. Dang what is going on? Ohhhh. Got a new one in the mail.
     
  14. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Okay let's all have a look at it....

    Whoh! Take that with your drone? LOL I was hoping for more of a profile pic of just the carb area, but this works. You have a 2210 carb, that's for sure. Pull that return spring off, as BigRigg suggested, and see how much life is left in it. It sure looks over-stretched to me. Some of the coils have gotten long. Then check the cable's free movement; see if there's much resistance to it sliding back and forth.

    You might need to buy and assortment of return springs to find one that works well in in that position. And be sure to double up on the spring (one smaller spring inside the other), for redundancy.

    And also as requested, let's see that bungee setup. Real curious about that.

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Just thinking, before you pull off that spring, work the throttle by hand with the spring in place 1-2 times. See how well it snaps back. It should snap back with some enthusiasm. And while doing that, see if the cable moves freely too and doesn't want to bunch up or otherwise offer resistance.

    FYI, the cable end is just snapped onto a little ball on the throttle arm. You can get it off there by just a little pulling and prying with a small tool like a flat head screwdriver. Comes right off. No need to unscrew anything there.
     
  16. TravelerMan79

    TravelerMan79 Farmall Cub

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    That spring is definitely over stretched, so probably has no where near the tension it should have. When I tried to mount mine to the same anchor point, I began to over stretch it, so I put it back where it was. You need a longer spring for sure, but as others have stated, check to make sure the cable isn't binding in its sleeve.
     
  17. Tremor

    Tremor Farmall Cub

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    hey everyone, just to close out this post and for anyone with this in the future. After tightening the accelerator cable closer to the pedal arm and replacing the spring the accelerator pedal returns great now. Thanks again everyone.
     
  18. winchested

    winchested Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    Good to know, you should be running a dual return spring not a single. Safer.
     
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  19. Patrick Morris

    Patrick Morris Lives in an IH Dealership

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    I'd mentioned that somewhere above, and about buying an assortment of some kind, which are cheap. The assortment I got a while back had several springs with captured inner springs. Hopefully Tremor has configured it that way.
     
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