Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by graedin, Mar 10, 2012.
The Derale fan is more than adequate bubba. You're setup is more critical than anything
I'm running a Dodge Viper fan. Its a thin profile and has the rubber flaps too. Not that I ever drive that fast LOL
I got it for free as the shroud was cracked from an accident. ( A friend sells Viper parts)
I've done a ton of stuff to mine in the quest for a cooler running engine.
Jack can you post a picture of the front of you Scout, and a pick of the fan under the hood. Just looking to see an overall picture of your setup.
Next would be know some other details, you might have listed them before but a list would help.
1: radiator new, used,copper or aluminum and number of cores.
2: t-stat Robertshaw version?
3: Water Pump, cast or stamped sheet metal impeller. There are some not so good cast ones out there. If you replaced the WP, did you happen to use modeling clay to measure the clearance.
Any details help.
Edit: the bigger the fan the more cfms you have. Scouts came with an 18" fan looking at the specs.
Also on a side note, a friend is working on a pulley setup that spins the water pump faster. So far he made a 10% and 15% faster pulley setup. This is not the holy grail as he puts it, but just the next step. http://www.ihpartsamerica.com/forum...c-tech/11548-water-pump-overdrive-pulley.html
I ran Plumbers ridge a few years ago.
R290, You're kind of a cooling junky aren't you?
I played with my setup quit a bit as well....Kind of a trial and error, but when I finally hit the nail on the head the improvement was dramatic. It turned my outlook on electric setups 180 degrees. Couldn't be happier I took the "chance".
Setup is everything. A 1500cfm fan could probably out cool a 2500 cfm fan just on setup alone.
In this situation however, as far as just the fans itself, its hard to compare anything as it seems everyone here has installed a fan they have no CFM data on.
Regarding setup: I have a large AC condenser (I assume factory but don't know) that sits immediately in front of my radiator. It covers most of the radiator and thus impedes flow. In front of that I have a small tranny cooler (I assume factory but don't know) that spans the bottom of the ac condenser. I have an aftermarket ss grill with huge holes to help with air flow. I have a winch mounted in front of that with controller on the side to prevent air blockage. I don't run the ac if it is hot. Lately, I've been running the heat when hot, my wife loves that. My feet are now jerky.
Radiator is a new 3core champion (aluminum). Water pump is a stamped impeller (98% sure on that). It looked new when I performed my engine rebuild (PO put water pump in). I measured the fin gap and it was good (don't have it with me). Tstat is robertshaw 180. Last weekend I swapped in a backup on the trail and it made no difference.
Gap from core to front of water pump is 3 5/8". I'm either going with one big fan or 4 little ones...I'll pull the trigger soon and welcome insight as the cfm precautions are worrisome.
ps. I don't want to hijack this thread and am happy to initiate a new one but think this is relevant.
pps can't upload photo here, will work on that
Dang that sucks, Better get it fixed or your wife will always be busy when you want to go for a drive.
I have a Volvo fan you can test with. ( friend commutes to the bay area for work)
how I tested my fans. I did the simple test. I connected the fan to a battery and if want to take off like a helicopter I said ok that ones pretty good. I upgrade my eletrical to handle to the load. I would not want to run all that power through my dash via the amp meter.
R290, thank you for the offer of the fan, very kind of you.
I've been doing some reading and talked with a couple tech support folks about fans and sizes. There is consensus that cfm ratings are sketchy.
Summit Racing support folks recommended Maradyne fans although there are certainly other good brands. I like the idea of more than 1 fan for a backup/redundancy but 4 fans did not look like a great answer from a cost standpoint. I decided on 2 12" fans that have a good flow:
The amperage rating of fans is likely a better indicator of air to be delivered than cfm's claimed. I have an oversized alternator to handle these fans.
The two 12" fans will fit on a diagonal on the radiator and their support said should cool up to 450hp. I'm probably running a bit lower than that with my 345.
I'll pick up some sheet metal and start on a shroud. I'll run the two fans with two separate controllers one set to 180, the other variable to kick on higher when necessary.
To those running a thermostatic switch, where did you place the thermoprobe?
I always say I'm north of 500hp. Since I burn as much gas as a 500hp bigblock. LOL
I too like to know what the amp draw is.
I put the temp sensor in the upper radiator hose. I cut the hose in inserted a metal tube with the sensor in it. I made all my own stuff. .i.e. exhaust tubing and bung for temp sensor.
I'm running a 185 temp sensor and its been working just fine, as I have a 180 t-stat. I can point you in the right direction if you want.
Thanks for the detailed post about the switch.
After several frustrating hours I can't get this fan to fit in front of my water pump as the fan motor hits the pulley. Not sure where to go from here...
I put my switch in the port in the radiator designed for a thermal vacuum switch as part of my smog equipment. That of course will pose an issue at smog time.
I'm going to try one of the units that goes in between the fins of the radiator. It does not sound like a great idea to me but I'll see how she works. Some place those units within the rad hose where it joins the radiator but that seems like an invitation to leak.
R290, your solution looks great, well done as usual!
In a previous post, R290 made some good comments regarding general cooling issues. Thanks. One comment involved the by-pass Robert Shaw thermostat. This made me take a look at the one I've been using and I found it was not a by-pass type. I had trouble locating the Robert Shaw variety. But I found out NAPA also carries the correct one. Part number 369 180. It's also available in the lower temp number 369 160.
Skipped over most of this but im sure someone recommended Ford taurus fans. They couldnt keep a v6 taurus cool back in 1990.
Last place i worked at. Rocore. Made heat exchangers. They used Spal fans. I was told it was the only ones that could make a warranty.
That napa part online looks different than what ih parts sells:
I believe the correct part looks like the ih parts one pictured.
Thanks Oakland Jack. I now have the correct T-stat you mentioned. The Scout now runs a bit cooler. Since the ambient temps are cooler now, I'll have to wait 'til summer to prove the difference. Vapor lock has been my problem on hot days. I may try the 160 degree version.
might want to try so thermo insulation on the gas line near the engine..
Thanks R290. That's one idea I have not considered. Here's what I've done so far:
1. Replaced mech pump with electric to keep the pressure up at stop lights.
2. Installed a return path from carb back to the tank so cool fuel is constantly flowing.
3. Use high test gas during the summer months since the vapor pressure is higher than low test.
4. Corrected the T-stat (as per your post) so the flow to the radiator is better.
5. Eliminated the fan's thermo clutch. Now the fan is hard coupled to the water pump. (I may try the electric fan when I find the time.)
These have helped prevent stalling but I still notice some brief hesitation after the Scout is fully up to temp. I suspect the issue is inside the carb.
-----79 Scout II, 345, 4-barrel, 727 trans