Building Garage Any Words of Advice

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by fredsterra, Nov 16, 2007.


  1. jeff rotella

    jeff rotella Binder Driver

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    I have 208/3-phase at my shop. It is in a industrial area although there are houses on the street.It cost me about $1,000 extra on a new install. i don't know if the power co charges more for non-business use,or if they will even do it. Of the $1,000 only about $130 went to the power co. the rest went for a 3-phase breaker box and one extra wire in the wire from the pole (underground).
    I really like the pictures of Scouts and their garages and would like to see more. This brings me to the chicken & egg thing; do you(we) have a garage to work on your Scout(s)? or a Scout so you have something to work on in your garage?
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2007
  2. chevywoody

    chevywoody Farmall Cub

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    Did anyone mention a Beer fridge?

    My neighbor, 5 doors down, is the local hotrod guy. We have regular weekly meetings.....aside from size, heat, and the beer ridge...he has a home made....urnal!

    good luck
     
  3. MUDDAWG

    MUDDAWG Equal Opportunity Offender

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    homemade urinal huh?


    what ??? a funnel screwed to the wall and a length of garden hose?

    LOL
     
  4. rlireland

    rlireland Content Team Staff Member Moderator

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    Great looking garages!

    Since I had to build an attached garage to meet code, I was restricted in the size I could have (width of house and setback from street). The flood plain requirements accounted for the height of the the finished floor. It looked huge when it was empty but after stuffing in two Scouts, work benches, shelves, parts and tools, it seems like a closet now.

    [​IMG]
    Roy

    P.S. Another thread on garages can be found here. Clicky.
     
  5. rlireland

    rlireland Content Team Staff Member Moderator

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    Here's a shot of my epoxied floor after it was first layed down. Makes clean up easier and looks nicer than bare concrete. Holds up fairly well to floor jacks and such too.

    Roy
     

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  6. Tom Mandera

    Tom Mandera Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    Naturally.

    Look closely...

    [​IMG]
     
  7. pri

    pri High Wheeler

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    <off topic> hey! I want that fridge! </off topic>

    So, if I may summarize what we all concluded to...
    * Size doesn't matter, you end up with too little space anyway...
    * Height. 10 ft is marginal, 12 is okay, and 13 and up is great.
    * Lots of light! I have 30 fluorescent tubes 36 watt each, and I still need the halogen spotlight at times.
    * Wiring. Three phase for compressor and welder, and then lots and lots of outlets.
    * Epoxy the floor. I didn't and I kick my butt every time I have to get on the floor.
    * Good sized over head doors. The ones I got are too low, dunno if get the C1200 inside at all...
    * Ventilation. At least one big fan to suck out the smoke from welding.
    * Use cross beams that allow you to lift at least a 392 plus tranny... I did this (with a safety margin of 300% or so...)
    * Storage. Plan for lots of shelves, and a good sized peg board for tools.
    * Plumbing. One of the things I forgot about...
    * Insulation. Keeps it cool in the summer and nice and cozy in the winter.
    * Draines. Don't forget to let the floor slope towards the drains...

    Something I forgot here? :confused:

    Paul
     
  8. rlireland

    rlireland Content Team Staff Member Moderator

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    Paul,

    Good summary!

    I considered putting in a commode and sink in one corner. But it would have added at least $5000 to the cost of the garage and eaten up valuable floor space. In a perfect world, the shop would be twice the sq. footage of the house, attached with its own plumbing, heating and A/C, 220V three phase electrical feed and a connecting door so you don't have to go outside to get to the shop. Maybe after I hit the lottery...

    Roy
     
  9. Damon L

    Damon L Farmall Cub

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    Great thread as we're planning my future shop when we build the new house.

    Currently "we" have a 24 by 24 detached garage that is my shop and hopefully parking for the missus this winter. I'll try and get some pics up sometime this weekend, as I have a lot of stuff in here and have gone through numerous layouts.
     
  10. Hutch

    Hutch Farmall Cub

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    For lot's of gret ideas check out http://www.garagejournal.com
    Some of the garages over there are more like showrooms, but lots of cool ideas.
     
  11. Hutch

    Hutch Farmall Cub

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    oops, that should read great :stuart:

    Lot's of good ideas from everyone here too. I am using Google sketchup http://sketchup.google.com/ to layout my eventual garage remodel, right after I finish the bathroom, kitchen, and deck!
     
  12. Eric V Bielke

    Eric V Bielke Farmall Cub

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    5 years ago I dicided that I needed a decent shop---shopped around and got prices on a 30 X 40 metal pole barn---we have quite few Amish folks in our area so decided to have them give me a price--- for very little more they built me a 2 story gambrel roof building [see thumb nail].

    specs
    32 X44 main building 16 ft open sided shed on one side --8 ft shed on back
    10 foot ceilings 2 10 by 9 front doors --7 by 9 door on shed side --2 man doors into shed area 1 man door in rear-- 6 inch re enforced floor--6 inch insulation in walls--12 in ceiling--4 220outlets--double outlet every 6 ft on primeter walls--outside water spigots on all 4 sides along with electrical outlets --bathroom[best thing I did]--pegboard on wall attached with furring strips-- osb board on walls painted white-- white metal roofing on the ceiling

    This gave me a building with 1400 sq ft shop area plus 1400sq ft storage area on the 2nd floor-- plus 1000 sq ft of storage area under the shed area. One bay is 16 X 40 ft the other is 16 X 30--the other end of this is walled off for place to sit and shoot the bull etc[and yes there is the required IH frig] The shop is about 100 ft from the house with a evergreen hedge in between--

    If I was to do over again I would install radiant heating in the floor and go to 12ft ceilings. Recently installed 2 post lift and 10ft is a problem, other than that I am very happy with the shop!!!!
    Eric
     

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  13. Jeff Melber

    Jeff Melber Binder Driver

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    Quick note to Tom SS2, dude somebody parked a Heep in your pole barn!!!!

    Fredsterra,

    My last bit of advice would be to not get mired in details and loose a good chance to at least get a shop put up. You'll never cover all the bases. I've always figured if I waited to long trying to figure out every last detail I may mis the oppertunity to be successful. So there comes a point where you're committed to do something and you just gotta go for it. Take your best shot at it, get ya most of what you wanted and have no regrets.

    You'll notice in the right rear corner are the tubes for the radiant heat - not hooked up.

    That said, I used the pants off my polebarn even before the concrete was in it. I thought it would be neat to show you a picture of my barn as is and no where near finished, BUT VERY useable. The attached picture is about 25 minutes old. The projects going on in the picture are 91 cherokee for the nephew, JD tractor cab on a Kubota (fit by the way is very good. Curtis Cab for a JD 318 on a Kubota B7100), SD33T being readied for swap into an 800A, a yamaha blaster engine rebuild, of course the barn itself.

    Good Luck,
    Jeff
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2008
  14. TimGott

    TimGott Farmall Cub

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    As far as power goes.. sure 3 phase is nice, but everything to do with it cost 3x as much money.. price some circuit breakers/panels and you'll see what i mean... (besides if you ever needed 3 phase.. there are ways to "make" a 3rd phase we wont get into here...)Plus, you have to get the power company to put another meter in and pay for having two services... I would def. look into 8 ft. High output flourescent fixtures.. lots of nice bright light.. and instant.. even on the coldest kentucky days... when you get it done let me know.. i got some stuff to put in there! :beer:
     
  15. pri

    pri High Wheeler

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    Ah, electrical confusion... And mostly on my part... I think I've figured it out now though.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it in the US you wire one or two phases in residential areas, and three phase is almost only for industrial use?

    Over here in Europe almost everything is wired three phase. Even apartments are wired three phase, which is splitted into three one phase circuits at the breaker box.
    Two phase installations were used a short time in the late 50-ies and early 60-ies as a cheapo solution for power consuming devices like stoves and such, but now it's all three phase stuff that's installed.

    So, here all stuff you can get is either one phase (230 V) or three phase (400 V). I prefer three phase equipment as it runs much smoother and has better MTBF.
    So, there's the explanation for saying "wire three pahse"...

    Paul
     
  16. TimGott

    TimGott Farmall Cub

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    Hey pri, dont sweat it.. i think when you mentioned 400v you got the bb guys a little excited... the common power configuration in these parts is a 120 v. single phase system.. with 240V. between phases... at 60 hertz.. in commerical/industrial use 3 phase power is more common
    120/208 277/480 seem to be the most common..(sometimes you will see 120,240 and 480 delta systems) these however would be fairly impractical in your shop being that the majority of stuff you want to plug in is 120 single phase.. and would require a transformer and a seperate panel (at least if you had 277/480)( in the 120/208 config.. you would need to make sure you didnt put a single pole breaker on the odd leg. or you could watch the smoke roll out of your stuff :) )but hey im down with sweden using 400 V. seems like that would cause alot more injuries/deaths being that more people would be messin around with a higher voltage... but who knows.. maybe europeans dont go sticking their hands in live panels like they do in these parts...
     
  17. Dennis Bernth

    Dennis Bernth Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Eric, you can get that two feet at the cost of some of your storage, but you probably already know that. When I had my barn built, lifts were not common at all, so I figured ten feet would be plenty of height. Fast forward about 15 years, and I'm buying one...
    My buddy (who does building stuff, I don't) said no prob. We had to orient the lift so that we had the least cutting to do (which wasn't necessarily the way I wanted it oriented), but we only had to cut one truss (my trusses are four foot on center). We oriented the lift 'longways' with the trusses, cut out the one truss and built a support two feet higher up on it (basically replaced the bottom chord with one two feet up). There was plenty of bracing, and we walled off the two trusses on either side and then under the one we cut so we could reinsulate. Looks kind of funny, I have a 'cavern' over my lift in the shop, but I've not had anything that I couldn't fit into that cavern so far, and it's really nice when you're doing exhaust work and stuff to get that complete six feet of lift. It is a little scary if you ride the lift up to work the brakes or engine or whatever if somebody wants to get underneath and listen; you kind of get claustrophobic with those walls right up alongside the vehicle and not being able to see out.
     
  18. Eric V Bielke

    Eric V Bielke Farmall Cub

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    Dennis--- My buddy Stan and myself have already looked into raising the ceiling/floor to gain the extra height. it would be a lot of work but I think it is going to be a project in the near future.

    Eric
     
  19. William Griffin

    William Griffin High Wheeler

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    Here is more encouragement for putting the radiant pipes in the floor. I got in a hurry and didn't and have really regretted it since. Now I'm getting ready to do an outside wood furnace for the house and ........... no pipes. Today I was in a garage with a waste oil fired boiler feeding the floor pipes. It was about 35 outside and as soon as you walked in, it was nicely warm. I was kicking myself all the way back home. My shop is 24x32 with a 16' shed roof on one side, a 12' footer on the other and a 7' tall finished upstairs. I have 2 large I beams spanning the width dividing the ceiling into 3rds. They make pulling engines or unloading trucks a snap. I have a built in workbench in the back with a vertical I beam imbedded in the floor under it. That makes a nice anchor for pulling and also acts as a stop to catch a possible runaway. My electrician talked me into 8' lights but I don't like the hum they make or how they flicker in the cold. I have some 4' ones that I put up myself and they don't do any of that. I have a separate 200 amp service with it's own meter since I thought I might run a business out there some day. I pay $17/mo extra for that meter so in reality, I should have gone with a 400 amp service on the house with a 200 amp sub-panel at the garage since the business never materialized. They climate here in VA is probably similiar to KY and I'll say I work out under the 16' shed roof almost as much as inside. I also have 3 courses of block with an 8' wood wall on top and have been happy with that. I have a single 9X12 rool up door on the end and 1 36" metal door on the side. I cut out a hope in the side wall and put in a big window unit A/C which cools the place fine in the summer. I've had it 10 years and it's still a work in progress.
     
  20. pri

    pri High Wheeler

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    No problem, havent been sweating over this stuff since a co-worker dropped a wrench over the terminals of 10 KV supply transformer. I was 10 feet away and almost shat my pants...
    Thing is that higher voltage does not make shocks more lethal, it just makes it more prone to jump space and arc. It's the current that kills, and it also has to do with frequency. I'd rather get a shock from a 230 V 50 Hz european style outlet, than from a 120 V 60 Hz American. This due to the 60 Hz being more in sync with the human heart rate, and thus more dangerous.

    Paul
     

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