Anybody running a divorced transfer case in a scout ll?

Discussion in 'The Skunkwerks' started by vegestar, May 23, 2019.


  1. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    Or a Terra/Traveler? That would be more specific. Thinking about a very interesting powertrain swap for my 1980 Traveler. Hate to give up my Dana 300 but I can't have cake and eat it too... unless someone says I can? Any thoughts and advice are much appreciated.
     
  2. Jeff Jamison

    Jeff Jamison Lives in an IH Dealership

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    On a scout II I dont think there is enough length to do it.I traveler/terra should work as its the same wheel base as a travelall and they all have divorced case.There are 2 problems that I can see happening,one is the rear shaft being to short(dont think that will happen,my main concern would be front drive shaft clearing the tranny crossmember.
     
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  3. Darrel

    Darrel Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    A Traveler is easy if you don't have excess lift. A buddy of mine parted out a regular Scout II with a Clark 5 speed and divorced 205.
     
  4. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    Encouraging words gentlemen thank you. I haven't brought out a tape measure yet but my eyeballs say the new powertrain is shorter than the SD33 and T-19 so there's a good chance the Dana 300 can stay where it is. That's if I can figure out how to hang it there and if it can be converted to yoke input? Guess I'll do some research on that. I have a 205 as a backup plan so I should be covered as far as transfer cases go. I think my biggest hurdles with this endeavor are going to be motor mounts and shift linkage and like Jeff said getting the front driveline to clear whatever I fab up as a transmission mount. Hopefully I can keep the shop warm enough this winter to get some wrenching in during the off season.
     
  5. Chris Breedlove

    Chris Breedlove Farmall Cub

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    Check out Robert JetFxr 's post history. His SII I believe either does, or did, run a 5 speed manual IH tranny with a divorced case of some sort. Probably an Atlas. May give you some ideas.
     
  6. scout2000

    scout2000 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    I'm going to 2nd Jeff here, or, at least urge caution.

    When dealing with a 100" wheel base, there just isn't the room one might have with a conventional (and longer wheel base) truck. Truly, there are few things in this life that aren't accomplishable, for someone that puts their mind to it, but there is the potential for some pretty steep drive line angles I would be concerned with over the long term.
     
  7. Big Ed

    Big Ed High Wheeler

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    He had a custom machined adapter to marry a transfer case to the 5 speed. It was a transfer case stock to a Scout II, I believe. He may have also had some other combination at some point. Don’t know.

    Edit: I just remembered it wasn’t Robert, it was someone he knew.
     
  8. Sammy

    Sammy Y-Block King

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    I'm wondering what this interesting powertrain swap is that you can't run the dana 300? My junk has a Ford ZF with a dana 300. Albeit a jeep 300 but still a 300.
     
  9. Chris Keck

    Chris Keck Binder Driver

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    Eric Stude built a 1976 Scout 2 20 plus years ago with a Dana 20 to a divorced np205, they shared a u-joint, he ran it for years with no issues. Truck had a 6.9 diesel, T-19 wide, dana 20, np205 and a pair of Dana 60's with 38's. The scout is no longer with us, it was parted and scraped when he built a new rig.
     
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  10. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    Now that sounds like a fun Scout! And IH powered to boot. I have given thought to a 7.3 IDI but my donor was mated to a C6 so I would have had to track down manual transmission parts. I let the whole truck go away didn't have space for it at the time. The direction I'm heading now is Mercedes Benz but it's not the conventional OM617 that has been used in all kinds of interesting re-powers. What I have is the 6 cylinder diesel mated to a super rare manual 5 speed. Had it in 2 MB's now tons of fun with both but I've grown tired of this particular model series and the engine won't fit in any of my other Benz projects without considerable hacking. So if I'm looking at fab work to put this engine to use I might as well put the efforts toward getting my Traveler back on the road it's a much more useful vehicle anyways. Unfortunately I haven't had spare time to move this along but on the flip side that means my new business is doing well and I can't complain about that.
     
  11. Chris Keck

    Chris Keck Binder Driver

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    it was a fun truck, a very heavy fun truck like 6500lbs+ even with out a top or doors. Had a exo cage and if he could get by with 1/8" material he used 3/8". It was way over built.
     
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  12. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    As the gears turn... The soap opera of my life. I'm currently leaning towards the NP 205 for this project. The T19/300 will migrate over to the 76 in place of the 727. That truck is already lifted and has a roll cage so it will be the dedicated off road adventure truck and retain the naturally aspirated SD33 once I make one good engine out of the 2 on hand. I was reluctant to give up the 205 as it was possibly slated to go back in the 1970 K2500. But now I have a line on Duramax/Allison for that truck which will require some acquisition of unknown transfer case. If anybody has some good ideas for a passenger drop TC that will bolt up to the Allison I'm all ears. Really not up to speed on the newer stuff.

    So my NP 205 is of course the GM configuration which mounts via the adapter sleeve between trans and TC. My current thinking is to modify that adapter ( or build some sort of adapter that slides into it) to then attach whatever I have made as jackshaft from the MB trans to that. My question is: does anyone see issue with retaining that mounting configuration of the TC without a transmission being attached to it? Or should I be thinking about building a crossmember that hangs the TC like IH and Ford? And if so do I need to source a different case or does that mounting configuration use the 2 large bolt holes on the passenger side of the case?
     
  13. scout2000

    scout2000 Lives in an IH Dealership

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    Assuming that this is for a S2? There are others here with more expertise in this area, so I will leave the technical part of what works with what up to them and not stick my foot in my mouth in this area.

    However, the one detail that I would bring up, not only with the S2, but also with the Scout is the short 100" wheel base. Were I in your shoes, not just the divorced transfer case issue, but length of transmission, etc, can lead to some tight driveline angles. I suppose all of this is also dependent on if this is a daily driver, or an off road toy that gets used a couple of times a month. My only intent here is food for though on length of drive line items vs short wheel base vehicle.

    Good luck
     
  14. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    Jerry, thank you for concern and words of caution. Luckily this is for my traveler so I have some extra inches to work with. I haven't taken a tape measure to the new powertrain but there's a good chance it is shorter than the SD/T19 which would help even more. I might just go do that now. I am growing tired of convalescing in quarantine with symptoms of the plague. I won't be putting anyone in danger with a little trip down to the storage yard.
     
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  15. Darrel

    Darrel Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    You really need u-joints to reduce vibration and wear unless the cases are bolted together (i.e. married).
     
  16. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    There will be at least one u-joint in the equation. The MB uses a rubber companion disc in place of u-joints. Being the cars are IRS the differential is solidly mounted to the car and thus maintains a nearly straight driveline angle. The jackshaft I'll be making will basically be the front part of an MB driveshaft with the appropriate yoke welded to that to accept whatever u-joint is needed to mate with my other frankenstien creation at the transfer case.

    So my rough initial measurements are very encouraging. I already have an electric fan on the Traveler so total length measurements are from the mounting flange of the water pump pulley to the rear of transmission. I will most likely end up using an MB radiator as the inlet/outlet of the Scout rad are on the wrong side so I'll include those measurements as well. One other hurdle is the MB oil pan sump is in the front. I don't think this will be much of an issue though as the sump doesn't hang down as far as the Nissan and there appears to be loads of room to raise the engine up not to mention a considerable difference in total height of the two engines.

    Engine and trans total length: SD 59-60" MB ~ 50"
    Engine height: SD 30-31" MB 25-26"
    Radiator width: SD ~27" MB 27.5"
    Radiator height: SD 22.5" MB 21.5"

    The radiator width is really my only concern right now. Hard to say for sure until you can actually test fit but I would be concerned about cramming a plastic tank radiator that tightly between the core support opening. I actually have another MB radiator option that solves 2 issues at once. The MB uses an air to oil cooler that is mounted in a very awkward and precarious location just forward of the drivers side wheel well. My other radiator is the earlier design and has the oil cooler mounted alongside the radiator and the combination is an inch narrower. The downside here is the radiator is clearly smaller which may or may not be an issue. I'll have to try and see.

    All in all I'm excited to move forward. I'm waiting for some logistics to come together so I can start stripping my parts cars and sending them to scrap. Luckily these logistics involve me acquiring a new binder and who doesn't like that?
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2020
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  17. Big Ed

    Big Ed High Wheeler

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    I went as short as possible with the driveshaft between the 4 speed and transfer case, it’s 6-1/4” center to center.

    B7BB5836-1158-4F6E-9839-C1B1882C3C05.jpeg B71EA987-A23C-4EF9-9F21-509A43236B0C.jpeg
     
  18. vegestar

    vegestar Binder Driver

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    Thanks for that Ed. Gives me a great idea of the minimum space required to make this happen and a baseline for when I get to mocking things up.

    Back to thinking about TC mounting. The more I mull around the idea of hanging the 205 from the adapter sleeve the less I think it will work. In fact I'm almost certain it won't. Maybe it could in conjunction with some sort of support bracket from the 2 large bolts on the side of the case. Somewhere I think I have one of factory GM arms that went from those holes to the motor mount bracket? Guess I should poke around the net and see if I can't find some creative GM 205 mounting arrangements.
     
  19. Big Ed

    Big Ed High Wheeler

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    The early J##p guys would be laughing like crazy hearing 100” being referred to as short, they had very short driveshafts (after modifications) compared to Scouts.
     
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  20. Big Ed

    Big Ed High Wheeler

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    You’re welcome.
     

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