80/800 tank repair-upgrade

Discussion in 'General IH Tech' started by Bill USN-1, Jun 24, 2012.


  1. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Tackled some of the common issues with the 80/800 tanks today.
    One thing to note is the stock tanks have a very small pickup and fuel line in the 4cyl scouts and the v8's aren't much better. So while repairing the tanks i replace the pickup line with all new upsized line.
    For the 4 and 6 cyl I prefer the 5/16" line and if running a v8 then I upgrade to 3/8" line.
    This is a good upgrade anytime but if you have thoughts of an engine upgrade or EFI, you really should do it.

    I use the common steel brake line you can pick up at any parts store in premade lengths with flare nuts on each end. the pickup line is about 26" so I got a 60" one and cut it in half.

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    A little heat from a propane torch and the original fitting comes off the end. They are just soldered on.

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    Here's the old with the new 5/16 that I bent with my cheap hand tubing bender.
    With the 5/16 tube I drilled the original bracket hole out with 1 size larger bit. 21/64. Then slipped the bracket on the tube. If you noticed, I used a cutoff wheel to open up the top of the bracket fitting hole since you can't make as tight of a 90* bend at the top as the original tube had.

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    Then I sand the coating off where I want to solder and place it in the vice to hold it.

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    Then heat and apply flux to clean it and then heat and apply solder to tin both pieces and solder together.

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    When done, I made the lower bend to match the original and then used the cutoff wheel to cut the tip to match.

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    Simple flare unions and more line can be used to complete the upgrade.

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    I replaced the gauges with some universal ones that matched the originals so I picked up a couple new sending units.

    I simply modified them to match the movement of the originals and then removed the top mounting plate and replaced them with the plates from the original sending units. Pay attention to the hole location. They only go on the tank one way. You can see the new one as it came out of the box and then how i modified it by removing the drop extention and then turned the arm movement 90*. Then I just bent the float arm to match the original. Once I figured out what I needed it to do, it went together pretty quick. The second tank was much faster.

    [​IMG]

    I'll get some more pics as I finish this up and get the sending units installed. Then I'll replace the rest of the fuel lines to match.
     
  2. gillis51

    gillis51 Binder Driver

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    Looking forward to the rest of this post.
     
  3. GDB23

    GDB23 Farmall Cub

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    Where did you get the sending units? I'm guessing they're aftermarket?
     
  4. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    The sending units came from Amazon or Ebay I just searched for 2 that matched the values of the gauges and then removed the original mounting plates from the senders and installed them on the new sending units.

    One note to make is the bend in the pickup tube at the top of the tank should be bent at more then the 90* that I originally bent them. Once i installed the tanks and set the cover plates in place i noticed the plates would hit the pickup tubes. So if you look close you can see where i re-bent the tube to form around the top of the tank.

    Here's the sending unit.

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    The one on top is modified to match the original.

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    Making the gaskets.

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    Installed. I use a thin coat of silicon. Just enough to make it look wet but not enough to squeeze out when installed.

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    Right
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    Left
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    Lines formed to tank.
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    And the gauges used.
    they are led gauges so they have the low pressure oil and low level fuel lights.

    [​IMG]

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Carl Wiese

    Carl Wiese Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Awesome as always Bill!! Great write up with great pictures. Dad is getting an 800A on Saturday and we know already it has some tank issue. This thread is not only informative but very timely as well.
     
  6. Colin Rush

    Colin Rush Man of Voive Staff Member Moderator

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    A common treatment for tanks was to tinplate them as a rust-preventative and sealer. Most auto manufacturers did that up until plastic tanks became the norm. IHC actually patented some tin-plating processes in the early 1900s, which they then applied toward their cream separator bowls, fuel tanks, and refrigerator racks.

    Oregon Retinners in Hubbard, Oregon (just north of Woodburn, Brooks, and Salem) still does this. They still do a lot of work predominantly with old refrigerator racks, cream separator bowls, kitchen utensils, mixing bowls, milk cans, meat grinders, and fuel tanks. They also can repair any holes in tanks using a combination of tin plating and soldering. They should come in handy for Lyle's tank. I am going to have them tin an old vintage fuel can for use with my Tom Thumb engine.
     
  7. SCscoutguy

    SCscoutguy Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Fantastic work as usual Bill.
     
  8. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Thanks guys. Hopefully it helps some looking to upgrade.

    Something to clearify is the sending unots I used were for the gauges I used. So make sure the ones you pick match your gauge.

    It was fairly easy to remove the original mounting plate for the sending unit and move it over to the new sending unit.
    Just a little fileing on the center hole for the D shaped post and make sure you have it oriented correctly for holes to line up.

    I also replaced all the fittings on the selector valve from 1/4 to the 5/16 inverted flares and plumbed hard line straight to the selector.

    A good double flare tool and tube bender helps.
     
  9. Greg R

    Greg R Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    The parts, documentation, and thoroughness is superb Bill!!

    Silicone sealants of any variety were NEVER meant for fuel systems or contact with gasoline.

    Great thread for reference for us 800 guys

    Cheers
     
  10. CO-Scout

    CO-Scout Farmall Cub

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    Awesome write up....makes me wanna pull my tanks now.
     
  11. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Thanks,
    Something to keep in mind is I do not use silicon as a gasket.
    I only use silicon to help seal imperfections in the surface.
    that's why I use a gasket and only apply a thin see-thru coat of silicon. I use the ultra silicon that is oil resistant just like i use on valve covers and oil pans and must be O2 sensor safe....for obvious reasons.

    So once the part is tightened down there should not be any silicon squeezing out from around the gasket. And should not be touching the fuel.
    A gasket seals both ways. liquid in and dirt out.
     
  12. GDB23

    GDB23 Farmall Cub

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    Bill,
    This info couldn't have come along at a better time! Thank you very much! I have an 800b that is a father/son project (my son is 11 and helping turn wrenches and such), and we just pulled the tanks. The fuel gauge wasn't working, and the other guages were stock (without exact temp, amp, or oil presure readings). I'm gunna do basically the same upgrade.

    Looks great! I hope ours turns out to be as good!

    Thanks Again,
    GDB23
     
  13. Greg R

    Greg R Dreams of Cub Cadets

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    Any chance you can post gauge info, brand, etc? Those gauges look super, without bling and almost original

    Hey, I didn't mean to come across as raining on your parade. The only stuff I've found in 40+ years of wrenching that was fuel resistant and still be able to disassemble (and not come back to haunt me), has been the tried and true Permatex Type 2. Granted we see lots of abuse of an otherwise good sealant like silicone and it's variants, but with gasoline; it always seems to break down. Some slower than others, 5months, 5 years, just out the door; but seepage and the stains, eventually show up from the gasket/surface interface.
     
  14. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Here's the style gauges I used. I didn't see the 4 gauge set but heres the 6 gauge set.

    Gauge set
     
  15. Lyle Wiese

    Lyle Wiese High Wheeler

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    Perfect timing on this, Bill. I brought the 1970 800A home yesterday. It has the 232 with a 4 speed. The orginal issue was fuel delivery, but that was a few years ago. Not sure what else I will find once I get into it.

    Lyle
     

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  16. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I was just debating about putting those style tires on my 61 2wd.
    The son thinks they will look too agressive on it. But I don't like the little passenger car tires on it now.
    Are they 700-15's?
     
  17. Lyle Wiese

    Lyle Wiese High Wheeler

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    Yes, they are 700-15. Well at least 3 of them are. I think the one in the truck may have an air retention problem.

    Lyle
     
  18. retiredblue

    retiredblue Farmall Cub

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    Bill, did the sending units fit on your tanks- the round top portion? that is my only concern
     
  19. Doc Stewart

    Doc Stewart Content Team Staff Member Moderator

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    Permatex #3 "Aircraft Permatex" is easier to spread lightly on gaskets and is equally effective. A little can with brush in the lid lasts a looong time.
     
  20. Bill USN-1

    Bill USN-1 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    As mentioned, I removed the original top plate of the sender and installed them on the new sender.
    A previous owner had really cranked on the screws and the edge of the plate looked like a wave. So I took the opportunity to use a hammer to tap them all back flat. Just like straightening a valve cover or oil pan flange.

    You can see the new plate on the sender here.

    [​IMG]

    And with the original installed on the sender.

    All it takes is a little file to put the flat locating tab in the plate hole. make sure it is properly clocked since the screw holes only line up in one place.

    [​IMG]
     

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